Delete comment from: Elements Of Power
TimA:
Another multirole strike aircraft is the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet. And based on the thrust-to-weight ratio's, wing loading, and strike-optimized aerodynamic characteristics, I have always thought the best comparison for the F-35 was not the F-16 but the F/A-18. Rather than the F-16 which, granted they were shooting for originally, did not seem to hit.
SMSgt Mac:
From the now semi-famous ACSC paper written by then-LtCdr Bowman (and which I’ve cited many times), it is well known that initial objectives for the JSF Corner-speed was desired to be somewhere between “F-18 Like” and F-16 Like”. Any other description of F-35 capability objectives in relation to the other two fighters are conversational generalities. We DO have on the other hand, fighter pilots who’ve flown all three types who call their performance very similar, and some claiming the F-35 is ‘better’ in the aggregate. So if there is any ‘miss’ in this respect, it is in your own mind.
TimA said:
Now, you've posted article after article attenpting to demonstrate that, despite all appearances to the contrary, the F-35 has parity with the F-16 in air-to-air maneuvering performance. But here we have three articles that directly contradict this assessment. We have the report from the test pilot. And we also have the program office mentioning only that there is room for "slight" improvements to maneuverability by tweaking the control laws. Then they focus on other advantages (which I don't deny) the F-35 posses which would be relevant and were not tested. Then we have the third article providing a pilot's account of dogfighting an F/A-18 against an F-16 and saying, yep, that sounds pretty identical to what the F-35 went through.
Across the board it should be obvious that the F-35 was unable to achieve its objective for meeting "F-16 like" aerodynamic performance. But it does seem to match the F/A-18. Which isn't terrible for a strike fighter. But certainly not, as far as aerodynamics go, ideal for an interceptor or air dominance fighter. So let's be clear on what this aircraft is and isn't. And let's be ready to reconstitute the F-22 production line if of when our nation's security demands it.
SMSgt Mac Says:
First, the JPO statement made no mention of how much control laws can be ‘tweaked’ and to what benefit, "Slight" or otherwise. Another source may have said something similar, but they have no idea what the effects of doing anything small or large will actually be until they do the engineering, simulation, and flight tests. Given the focus in the testing was controlability at the edge of flight: post-stall controlability, all you can get out any changes would probably be ‘little’ because there is ‘little’ anyone can do in that region anyway. (Do you even know what post-stall means?) The JPO statement did make another statement:
There have been numerous occasions where a four-ship of F-35s has engaged a four-ship of F-16s in simulated combat scenarios and the F-35s won each of those encounters because of its sensors, weapons, and stealth technology.
Runs kind of ‘contrary’ to your imagination, doesn’t it?
Still more coming...
Jul 4, 2015, 1:13:39 AM
Posted to David Axe is More Boring Than Ever (Bless His Heart)