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Post a Comment On: Steve Sailer: iSteve

""How Single Motherhood Hurts Kids""

36 Comments -

1 – 36 of 36
Blogger Thursday said...

The thing to do is eliminate all welfare programs, and replace them with substantial cash payments to low IQ women for not getting pregnant. Substantial. And doled out weekly.

Have a child out of wedlock? Well, fuck you. Put it up for adoption and no money for you ever again.

2/10/14, 2:25 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Fifty years ago, American liberals noticed that high welfare payments and low public criticism of unmarried parental couples weren't immediately destroying Stockholm, so they figured it would make perfect sense in Milwaukee."

Steve, do you have any links that discuss / demonstrate that mid-twentieth century U.S. welfare policy was influenced by European models?

2/10/14, 2:29 PM

Blogger sunbeam said...

I wonder what it means that this is being published in the NY Times.

Just wonder... seems kind of like a marketing campaign to "catapult the propaganda," as one of our illustrious former Presidents put it.

Interesting. Personally I don't think the people who run this country are a monolithic bloc.

(ethnically, geographically, what have you, though due to the current FIRE composition of the US economy NY is an outlier in influence)

Wonder if we are seeing the
beginning of a debate to define the "elite consensus." (That term was used by a guest columnist on Joe Bageant's old site, and I like it)

2/10/14, 2:43 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Universal pre-K, for example, offers a sort of taxpayer-subsidized nap time for welfare moms to rest up so they can hit the clubs harder in the evening" Or new immigrant parents can work extra shifts in food prep and providing wealthy people child care. Universal Pre K also will provide lots of meaningful first jobs to graduates of expensive liberal arts schools that could lead to government pensions and health insurance. In NYC city child care is a cottage industry bringing business skills to the middle class, can't have that when you can employ the children of the rich.

Somewhat unrelated but kind of amusing thought process:

Rochelle Riley: Boarding schools for Detroit? Why not?

http://www.freep.com/article/20140209/COL10/302090060/detroit-education-boarding-schools-excellent-schools

2/10/14, 2:43 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"..any links that discuss / demonstrate that mid-twentieth century U.S. welfare policy was influenced by European models?"

well I can recall the consensus that the European welfare state being held up as a model that we should emulate...

2/10/14, 2:43 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The life of Shondrekia.

2/10/14, 2:44 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

This problem is hard to solve politically but trivial to solve policy wise. If you have a baby outside of wedlock you get no government money, healthcare, etc. Watching a few friends enter poverty would be enough to change norms very quickly.

My suggestion is politically impossible, Thursdays plan is a little harder to implement.

2/10/14, 2:50 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Apropos Pre-K, here's Russ Whitehurst's devastating congressional testimony about the federal Pre-K plan.

2/10/14, 2:51 PM

Anonymous Rifleman said...

My guess is, however, that working class whites are slowly drifting toward black norms...

Meaning working class White women and girls are working toward giving birth to more and more black children.

I've lived among these people. It's remarkable how many White women and girls are sexually obsessed with black males and have black children. This is increasing.

So when people speak about the behavior of "whites" in this context lets not pretend that blacks aren't involved.

Increasingly births to White females don't involve White children. Maybe because this often happens out of wedlock it is harder to quantify.

2/10/14, 3:06 PM

Anonymous Reg Cæsar said...

Steve: Universal pre-K, for example, offers a sort of taxpayer-subsidized nap time for welfare moms to rest up so they can hit the clubs harder in the evening and create more little net tax consumers / Democratic voters.

In other words, "pre-K" really means "pre-r".

2/10/14, 3:07 PM

Blogger Luke Lea said...

sunbeam asks, "Wonder if we are seeing the
beginning of a debate to define the "elite consensus."

My guess is that it is like it was with quantum vs. classical physicists. The quantum guys never convinced the classicals that they were wrong. Instead the classicals died out and were replaced by the new generation.

Can't wait till my generation dies off. Too bad I won't be here to see it.

2/10/14, 3:15 PM

Anonymous Education Realist said...

It's not weight, whatever it is. African American girls are overweight long before they get pregnant, and many young Hispanic moms are still quite thin. Not sure about low income whites (not a lot of them in my area).

Also, the big problem with welfare wasn't any comparison with Sweden, but the Cloward Piven strategy of rioting to get more money.

I do think it's economic. Women at the low end of the income scale suffer nothing from having a child, and get more attention. We either do the stick, penalizing them for having a child, or we do the carrot, and pay them for not having children.

We can't possibly make the stick painful enough to discourage childbirth, so we have to go the other way.

The problem is the backlash by elites would be huge.

2/10/14, 3:36 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Benefits street - British TeeVee
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benefits_Street

2/10/14, 4:01 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is that how the first Sailer child was produced? I mean I get it you don't actually think like that and it's simply bait for the frustrated virgin demo but honestly what a crappy thing to say.

2/10/14, 4:08 PM

Anonymous ben tillman said...

This problem is hard to solve politically but trivial to solve policy wise.

Indeed.

If you have a baby outside of wedlock you get no government money, healthcare, etc. Watching a few friends enter poverty would be enough to change norms very quickly.

The 1996 welfare almost immediately stopped welfare mommas from having a third baby.

2/10/14, 4:43 PM

Anonymous Tony said...

"I wonder what percentage of these "unplanned" pregnancies have to do with women getting tired of dieting to look hot. Okay, I've got a guy interested in me, kind of, but now I'm hungry all the time. If I go off my diet, he'll probably dump me for that skinny skank Amber."
Not so Steve. The black male likes em big and chunky.

2/10/14, 5:22 PM

Anonymous Crawfurdmuir said...

"Steve, do you have any links that discuss / demonstrate that mid-twentieth century U.S. welfare policy was influenced by European models?"

Certainly the greatest change in U.S. social policy during the latter half of the twentieth century was most profoundly influenced by a Swede - Gunnar Myrdal.

2/10/14, 6:27 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Guys, do not trust your girlfriend to take care of the contraception. She has her own agenda."

Depends what social demo you're in (or more precisely, which one your girlfriend is in). Stories of youngish, white, college-educated women lying about birth control are fairly rare. On the contrary, in my experience, most women in that demo have repeating iPhone alarms to remind themselves of their sterility pill. (Or maybe they just REALLY don't want my beta babies?)

2/10/14, 6:39 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

1) Any criminals convicted of non-violent crimes can shorten their incarceration period by undergoing permanent sterilization. Anyone convicted of a violent crime automatically undergoes sterilization.
2) Any person who has been on welfare for two years or more must undergo permanent sterilization in order to enjoy continued support.
3) Any person who goes on welfare surrenders all confidentiality with regards to their reproductive health. If a woman on welfare becomes pregnant, her doctor is legally obligated to inform the government. At this point, the pregnant woman can terminate the pregnancy or or lose welfare benefits for the rest of her life, regardless of how many children she currently has.
4) No one over age 22 whose education is high school diploma or below is eligible for any sort of welfare. (Things like specialized driver's licenses and skilled trades do count as education)
5) A woman who has a child out of wedlock is never eligible for welfare, ever, regardless of how many children she currently has.
6) If a couple divorces while they have a child under the age of 16, they must both pay a divorce tax to compensate society for the resulting likely loss of productivity and the probable increased strain on the law enforcement and welfare systems that results from a child growing up without two parents in the home. In cases of physical abuse, this will not apply.
7) Just as women enjoy the right to terminate their pregnancies, men will now have the right to terminate their paternal responsibilities prior to the birth of the child. If a woman becomes pregnant, she has three months from the onset of pregnancy to convince the father to sign a legal declaration stating that he is the biological father and that he intends to be jointly responsible (with the mother) for the raising of the child until the child turns 18. If the three month period comes and the father has not made such a declaration, then he has absolutely no obligation whatsoever to the child or its mother.

2/10/14, 8:09 PM

Anonymous Hunsdon said...

Reg Caeser said: In other words, "pre-K" really means "pre-r".

Hunsdon: I'll have to check, but I think you just won the internets for the whole day.

2/10/14, 8:19 PM

Blogger flambeaux said...

"Boarding schools for Detroit? Why not?"

Welcome to the Ludus Academy of New Detroit.

2/10/14, 9:28 PM

Anonymous Old fogey said...

Many thanks to "anonymous" at 2:51 for the link to the Brookings expert's testimony about early childhood education. Pity that he didn't add the obvious though, that such programs belong to the states, not the feds.

2/10/14, 9:49 PM

Anonymous Crawfurdmuir said...

Anon. at 8:09PM On 2/10/2014 wrote: " Anyone convicted of a violent crime automatically undergoes sterilization. "

No - neutering. I have often wondered if not only the obvious problem of sexual promiscuity, but also the high rate of violent crime amongst young, low-IQ males, was due to their excessive testosterone combined with lack of self-discipline and forethought. Sterilization by vasectomy leaves the source of testosterone intact, only preventing fertility. We need
to remove not only the fertility but also the testosterone.

In order to stop a tomcat or a male dog from fighting, pissing on things to mark his territory, and impregnating every female he can, we castrate him, and thus render him tractable. These behaviors are clearly paralleled in the behavior of the lumpenprole human male - the appalling numbers of of homicides, the defacing of property with graffiti (much of it gang-related), and the high rate of bastardy. The remedy is equally clear.

2/11/14, 12:43 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

For me, as a regular Finnish reader, this whole conversation seems very typically American. I was born out of wedlock and so were many of my friends and schoolmates although I attended the best school in my hometown. Still both of my parents were academically educated and had good, steady jobs. I don't think that my mother was especially dependent on welfare; she was quite capable of supporting herself and me with her salary and, as far as I can tell, my father never tried to shirk from his alimony payments. I actually never even thought, that illegitimate birth is something strange and a real social problem, before I started to read these American (and also British) blogs. Clearly there is a huge cultural difference between America (and maybe Anglosphere in general) and , e.g., Nordic countries.

2/11/14, 3:17 AM

Blogger Xenophon Hendrix said...

Reforming the welfare system or underclass culture is hard to do. Would making intrauterine devices simple to get be a partial solution we can actually implement in the near term? By "simple to get" I mean free, that is, paid for by the government, and promoted by social workers and welfare providers -- even high schools, if that is politically possible. By "promoted" I mean to the extent of arranging clinic appointments, reminders, and rides.

The cost of an IUD isn't trivial, but it's cheap compared to the cost of providing transfer payments to support a child. Compared to other contraceptive measures, IUDs cannot be forgotten or stopped on a whim. Removal requires a doctor's appointment.

2/11/14, 5:16 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"I actually never even thought, that illegitimate birth is something strange and a real social problem, before I started to read these American (and also British) blogs."

The effects of bastardy hit the IQ underclass particularly hard. Because of the greater, uh, vibrancy of the US and the UK as compared to Finland, we have a larger IQ underclass.

2/11/14, 9:07 AM

Anonymous jody said...

"New girlfriends/wives show remarkably little female solidarity toward the idea of their man turning over a big chunk of his paycheck to ex-girlfriends/wives."

huzzah!

biology strikes again

2/11/14, 10:49 AM

Anonymous countenance said...

Nor is it likely, from the overlooked child’s point of view, that a mother’s new boyfriend or husband can fill the gap. There’s substantial research showing that stepfathers are sometimes worse than none at all.

Stepfathers often murder the mother's infant children, (she'll have sex with him and have his children sooner rather than tending toward another man's kids), lean on the mother to throw out adolescent boys, (eliminating a potential challenge for male leadership in the household), and the mother herself throws out adolescent girls (to eliminate female competition for the man).

The first two have very strong parallels in lion behavior.

Also complicating low-income single parenthood in America is what the experts call “multipartner fertility.”

Translation: All my babydaddys, all my babymammas. Dontravious D'Cornerback has 10 kids by 9 women and each of those 9 women have lots of other kids by lots of other men.

I wonder what percentage of these "unplanned" pregnancies have to do with women getting tired of dieting to look hot.

I wonder what percentage of those "unplanned" pregnancies are just ghetto meal tickets for a government check or suing the father for child support.

2/11/14, 2:15 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon 6:39, I've got two words for you...Bridget Moynihan. She pulled the goalie to get coveted Tom Brady spawn.

2/11/14, 2:34 PM

Anonymous NOTA said...

Waldman is exactly right about a couple important parts of the picture:

a. Marriage habits in 2014 vary a great deal by education, intelligence, and social class. Because of that, different outcomes for married and unmarried couples right now reflect both whatever benefits there are to marriage, and also all the stuff that marriage correlates with like having a higher IQ and better judgment and a more functional set of role models in your life. (That's also part of what's going on w.r.t. different relationships between marriage and happiness in other countries; you're not correlating with the same stuff.)

b. Marriage isn't just a relationship between two people in isolation. Instead, it's a *whole set* of social relationships and expectations and assumptions. Part of why marriage is stronger in my social class than at the bottom is because those assumptions are different. How acceptable is it to run out on your wife and kids? How acceptable is it to have a couple kids before you're ready to settle down? A lot of peoples' practical decisionmaking is made on the basis of what their friends will think--far more than is made on the basis of careful planning for the future. (That's why a lot more people have nice cars in their driveway than have enough saved up for retirement.).

Now, it's certainly plausible that marriage has some benefits outside of signaling your adherence to middle class values, and even some benefits that exist when you are living in a subculture that doesn't support or value it. But it seems almost certain that the benefits are a lot less at the bottom than at the top.




2/11/14, 4:24 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

All of the guys I grew up with who got into trouble later on all had one thing in common. No dads. Either through abandonment or premature deaths.

2/11/14, 8:20 PM

Anonymous anon 2 anon said...

To anonymous at 2:34 - if you are capable of understanding why Tom Brady's father is, and ought to be, ashamed of his son, then you have a chance of understanding the world and country you live in. Your use of that stupid "goalie" idiom leads me to believe that you are, and will, remain clueless. If you think, in your little Vonnegut-Carlin-JonStewart-genetic-loser-world, that I am wrong about you (which I hope I am) feel free to point out why you, hypothetically, would not be distressed to find out that your grandchild, like poor Mr Brady's grandchild, doesn't get to have a real father.

2/11/14, 9:25 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

#7
The guy does have choice in the decision to become a parent. He can use birth control: condom, vasectomy, or abstinence. Seriously, the way people act you'd think we were one of those primitive tribes who haven't discovered what causes babies. If we could make non - support a serious crime (jail time?) men would start clamoring for their own "pill".

2/12/14, 4:43 PM

Blogger RobertW said...

Wait a second. Am I to understand that the NY Times printed a column about single mothers that was anything other than laudatory? I guess Hell really can freeze over.

2/12/14, 7:08 PM

Blogger Marissa said...

. He can use birth control: condom, vasectomy, or abstinence.

Should these be the only choices for the women?

2/13/14, 10:08 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Maternal custody is not the worst thing that can happen to a child.

However, it is the worst thing that does happen to most children.

Anonymous age 71

2/13/14, 5:55 PM

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