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Post a Comment On: Rany on the Royals

"For Want Of A Pitcher, Part 5."

35 Comments -

1 – 35 of 35
Blogger Evan said...

Wonderful, as always.

November 4, 2011 at 12:13 AM

Blogger jeff said...

Really awesome piece! Just thinking about some of these names makes me excited. I like so many of your ideas. but I especially like the idea of a one for one of Myers for Beachy.

November 4, 2011 at 1:46 AM

Blogger McGoldencrown said...

Very nice piece. I would have paid a dollar for it....

The only scenerios that need to be addressed are 5) and 6). Get the Minor for Myers (plus a throw-in) deal done as soon as possible, then put a 50 mil bid in for Darvo.

Thats it! 2012 should not be a all-in affair! We are building for the long haul, lets not get jumpy.

Without Darvish, our rotation looks like this: Minor, Paulino, Hochavar, Duffy, Montgomery, Teaford.

Then, after an 86 win, 2nd place '12, you add Odorizer and if necessary, a FA SP to the mix, and really go for it in '13.

Post Script: Rany, any chance you could get your links to open in a separate window?

November 4, 2011 at 7:23 AM

Blogger McGoldencrown said...

.....Obviously, you have to offer Arb to Chen to get the Supp pick, and I hope he would pass, but that seems a 50/50 prop. If he accepts, that just throws another arm into the mix. I like Teabag as a sleeper, so again, I would hope he passes.

November 4, 2011 at 7:30 AM

Blogger Fast Eddie said...

Of course, Royals fans, you can bet your bottom dollar that Jurrjens will be in a Kansas City uniform come spring training.

November 4, 2011 at 8:09 AM

Blogger Todd said...

Thanks for your detailed geek fest of the Royals pitching options. Hopefully we will be talking about Daytons success this time next year.

November 4, 2011 at 10:00 AM

Blogger Kyle said...

Dayton has done a great job the past 2 seasons in the FA/trade market. Let's hope he keeps it up. I would be fine with Chen staying, but it isn't a sexy pick. Going after any of the first 5 options sounds like a plan to me.

I do think the Royals lineup/bullpen are ready to compete in 2012. They are missing a #1 and #5, or two middle of the rotation guys. If they have 4 #3 SP, I think they can win 85 games. That's close enough for "competing" in my book.

November 4, 2011 at 10:08 AM

Blogger Tampa Mike said...

I would like to pick up Minor, but I'm expecting Jurrjens. I think your outlook on Jurrjens might be a little harsh, but I agree there is some risk of regression there.

I would expect a trade with the Rays, probably for Wade Davis. The Rays will probably have him in the bullpen anyway.

November 4, 2011 at 10:10 AM

Blogger Tim said...

Now that it's time to actually use these prospects as trade chips, I find myself getting all sentimental and wanting to hoard them. I know that the smart way to contend is to use some of this capital we've acquired, but it's going to be bittersweet if we have to give up big name prospects. I just have to remind myself that we can't have it both ways.

November 4, 2011 at 10:40 AM

Blogger Dixon said...

This 5-Part Mini-Series has been epic, Rany. You're the best. Finally, an off-season to be excited about. Can't wait to see what happens now.

November 4, 2011 at 10:41 AM

Blogger Scott D. Simon said...

Rany, thanks again for keeping this site going. Love it.

November 4, 2011 at 1:43 PM

Blogger noseycat said...

Great article! I really like the sound of a rotation which would feature Edwin Jackson, Gio Gonzalez, Hochevar, Paulino, and Duffy/Montgomery/Chen/Teaford.

November 4, 2011 at 2:04 PM

Blogger JawsRecliner said...

Rany - great job. I do not think you are crazy to think the Royals can compete in 2012. They absolutely can! They have to add starting pitching for sure. I just hope GMDM acts sooner rather than later...

November 4, 2011 at 2:29 PM

Blogger ChrisInKC said...

I love the idea of Edwin Jackson! If Matt Garza could be had for a Montgomery/Odirizzi and a Robinson, I might wet myself! Garza, Jackson, Hochevar, Paulino, and Duffy...looks good in the Central, and we didn't give anything away that would have contributed in 2012. The combo of Wandy and Gonzalez would be intriguing, but Myers would be in Oakland...I wish this Hot Stove stuff would pick up! The suspense is killing me.

November 4, 2011 at 2:33 PM

Blogger Brian B. said...

Very nice! I'd put Yu Darvish up as #2 priority and increase my willingness to pay - I like being able to use prospects elsewhere, and I think Moore should be able to finagle an $80 million budget that fits Jackson and Darvish if he was able to get $75 million for the '09 and '10 Royals - but I really like how you think, and the thoroughness you've put in.

You made me think of an unrelated idea. Is there a third team, one with a great-glove young shortstop, we could involve in a swap for Asdrubal Cabrera, whom we could install at second base?

I'd pay Giavotella and Cain for him, and while Cleveland wouldn't make the swap directly, there might be a team who'd take Giavotella/Cain for gloveman SS plus solid Grade B prospect and talk Cleveland into taking *those*. Thus giving the Indians' pitcher strategy a chance to work.

November 4, 2011 at 2:35 PM

Blogger royalsfanatic said...

My explanation-maybe Jurrjens is just a RH version of Jamie Moyer.

Without diving as deep into the #'s as you did, I never could really put my finger on why Moyer was as good as he was so late into his career other than tagging him a "crafty lefty".

Moyer's K rate, K/BB ratio and BABIP were never anything to marvel at, but there was a decade after he entered his early 30's where it seemed like he had 25 starts a year where he went 7 IP with 3 ER and 3-4 Ks.

Im not advocating the Jurrjens trade...but if the price is Cain, I wouldnt be looking for a bridge to jump off of.

November 4, 2011 at 3:22 PM

Blogger royalsfanatic said...

Crystal ball it for me:

A Royals team that has a healthy rotation of

Darvish
Edwin Jackson
Jurrjens
Hochevar
Paulino

wins how many games in 2012?


Are we in the high 80's?

November 4, 2011 at 3:25 PM

Blogger Michael said...

We are on the same page Rany. Get a guage on the price tags of Hernandez and Kershaw. I know it would be astronomical, but I really think it'd be worth it. 3 years of Hernandez, or 3 of Kershaw is worth a lot of prospects, who may or may not work out. Matt LaPorta was very highly thought of when Cleveland acquired him for CC Sabathia a few years ago. That's just one example, but there are many more where highly touted prospects didn't make it in the majors.

Secondly, while I would love to see the Royals get a pitcher of Darvish's ability, I think the price tag is just too much. Like you said, he's younger and better than Matsuzaka was when he came over, so the assumption has to be that he'll be at least as expensive, if not more. Dice-K cost more than 100 mill over 5 years, including posting fee. If they do Darvish, they won't have the money to do anything else.

I have also advocated a 2 year contract with a vesting option for Roy Oswalt. Although I doubt that he'd take it if a number of other clubs offered anything remotely close to it. And I don't think there's any chance Javier Vazquez comes to KC. He's shown a preference to stay somewhat near the southeast, closer to home for him. And since we can't offer that or the guaranteed chance at competitiveness, I think he retires or signs elsewhere.

Overall, I like your thinking though. I think I'd die if the Royals actually traded for Hernandez or Kershaw though. But at least I'd die a happy man. :)

November 4, 2011 at 4:21 PM

Blogger Phil said...

Jair Jurrjens. Thoughts?

November 4, 2011 at 4:54 PM

Blogger Exodor said...

I just don't see Oswalt signing in KC unless we pull a Meche and outbid the market. I think we have to offer him at least 3 years if not 4.

November 4, 2011 at 6:12 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

As a Braves fan, I really don't think they would be willing to part with Minor or Beachy. Wren holds onto these prospects like no GM I've ever seen. Hudson, Hanson, Beachy, Minor and either Teheran or Delgado will be the rotation next year.

I think they will end up trading Jurrjens for something. Given that this is a Royals blog, what do you think is a reasonable package? They'd need to give up more than Cain to get him. Would Cain and Cheslor Cuthbert be something you think Moore would part with?

November 4, 2011 at 7:13 PM

Blogger GoBarn@gmail.com said...

That was hilarious. It was one of my favorite pieces of yours because offseason trade / free agent speculation is baseballs equivalent of the NFL draft. and you gave us a great shot of the draft board with your summary! What an awesome thought it would be to have an Ace pitcher again to go along with Hoz and company.

November 4, 2011 at 7:17 PM

Blogger Fast Eddie said...

MLB Trade Rumors now says that Jurrjens to KC talks have hit a snag. Maybe DM read Rany's piece???

I see Andres Blanco is now a free agent. Might be a good guy to pick up as a backup ss candidate.

November 4, 2011 at 9:43 PM

Blogger Antonio. said...

15. Call up this Rany Jazayerli guy and try to buy him out of his day job to become special assistant to GM.

November 4, 2011 at 11:57 PM

Blogger Fast Eddie said...

Jonathan Sanchez?

November 5, 2011 at 3:22 PM

Blogger Akagi Minomura said...

1) About Kershaw and Felix, it is impossible, especially with the price range you've mentioned. I bet Dodgers and Mariners would find it as an "insult."

2) Yankees and Red Sox will easily out-bid 4/50. Especially for Royals, they need to shoot more than that.

3) Gio Cahill and Shields, leverage is on Friedman & Beane's hands and they are not easy to trade with. They would command two grade A prospects to begin with, especially all of grade As you wrote have great down years.

4) Makes sense. But with more $$$ since Royals is not that attractive to him yet, in terms of market plus winning.

5) Makes sense. Myers plus other prospects would be enough to lure either one of those.

6) No way it is going to happen. Yu would easily exceed $50m for posting due to market condition and he would command much more than 6/40 since he only has about a year or two left to hit free agency. He can make at least "7m" just staying at Japan, and he repeatedly said he likes idea of staying at Japan. He will be still 26 when he hits FA and would make much more than 6/40. Yu Darvish is already making more than $6.5m in Japan. He will make $7.5m next year in Japan, $9m on his final year of contract. Do you seriously he would want to play with losing team (as of right now)small market with no Japanese background (Unlike Dodgers) who would pay even less than what he makes? He mentioned so many times that he does not have strong desire to play in big league. Bottom line that he would want is 5/65 with posting well above $50m.

7) Agree on Nimann and Norris parts but Garza would cost much more. Garza is improved this year, very durable, showed the world he is legit #2. Would cost more than what you listed.

8) Makes sense, but i'm more inclined to say it would not be grade A straight-up since other teams will not value them as high as royals does, due to big regression happened to those prospects this year. should add one or two C+ prospects also.

9) Anibal Sanchez is not avaialbe in that price range. Other pitchers, yes, but for Wandy, just because Astros Gm is known for his stupidity.

10) two years is bottom line.

11) Great choice, which I would prefer all day.

12) Makes sence. Like it also.

13) I love the idea. I would prefer Burnett.

14) It would be just insurance.

15) +1

November 5, 2011 at 4:01 PM

Comment deleted

This comment has been removed by the author.

November 5, 2011 at 4:01 PM

Blogger Michael said...

Fast Eddie-Love the Jonathan Sanchez idea. Sabean is a loon, so you could probably get him for a good price too. Strikes out a ton, but also walks a ton too. If you can somehow get him to not walk as many, he'd be a stud.

November 5, 2011 at 6:00 PM

Blogger bbxpert said...

What is the matter with Jurrjens and Prado? An All-Star starting pitcher and a second baseman who was an All-Star in 2010 for 2 minor leaguers. We fill 2 weak positions.

November 6, 2011 at 3:35 PM

Blogger Antonio. said...

But the Red Sox/Yankees won't necessarily bid higher than the proposed $40 million dollar posting fee. After that, the Japanese free agents don't have that much leverage, as the Red Sox proved to Scott Boras and Daisuke Matsuzaka.

November 6, 2011 at 8:32 PM

Blogger Michael said...

Akagi-I'm sorry, but you are wrong. If the Royals called up either team, especially the Mariners, and offered a package starting with Monty and Myers, they would at least listen to the rest of the offer. Not saying they'd necessarily take it, but they'd listen. They wouldn't be "insulted" as you think. I'm not as attuned to their organizational needs, so I don't know what else they would want, but I have a feeling we could find something that works for both sides.

November 7, 2011 at 8:30 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wow - all that "ink" spent listing all the FA and trade possibilties, and The Royals get one who's not on even that comprehensive a list.

November 7, 2011 at 12:32 PM

Blogger royalsfanatic said...

Holy crap....Melky for Jonathan Sanchez....I am floored.....wow....initial gut reaction? SWEEEET!

I know Sanchez has walk issues, but still.....SWEEET

November 7, 2011 at 12:32 PM

Blogger Jeff said...

This piece was incredibly detailed, yet DM still found a pitcher not on your list. Any thoughts on the Melky/Sanchez trade?

November 7, 2011 at 1:23 PM

Blogger Fast Eddie said...

Thanks Michael, maybe Dayton is listening to me as well as Rany now! I knew Giants needed outfielders & these two teams were a good trade match for that reason.

November 7, 2011 at 1:43 PM

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