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Post a Comment On: Rany on the Royals

"Kansas City Chiefs' Playoff Odds, Week 14."

25 Comments -

1 – 25 of 25
Blogger Nathan said...

OK, I know the Phillies don't match up with the Royals. But imagine IF they traded for Greinke. Would it be the best rotation of all time? If you were Amato, would you pull out all the stops just for a shot at that kind of immortality? They could even keep the same group of five aces in place next year!

December 15, 2010 at 1:28 AM

Blogger George said...

Certainly an interesting idea, but I don't see it happening. Any move the Phils make for Greinke would include their best prospect Domonic Brown and would leave the cupboard pretty bare--not that that really matters to them at this point. As a Royals fan, Brown would be the ideal CF/lead-off hitter that we desperately need. I'm not sure they have the multiple prospects we'd want though. Another interesting rumor I saw was Greinke to the Dodgers in a deal for Matt Kemp. I know he had a down year last year, but he could be huge.

December 15, 2010 at 1:02 PM

Blogger Nathan said...

Now, Greinke for Kemp sounds intriguing.

December 15, 2010 at 6:38 PM

Blogger Jason said...

If it were Greinke for Kemp, D Gordon and Kenley Jansen, I might go for that. Kemp will make 6 million or so this year be up for abritration in '12 and a FA in '13 (course, he'd likely be a type A), so the Royals would need some future, as well as some current to make it worth it, imo.

December 16, 2010 at 10:04 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jason, that deal makes more sense to me than many of the others I have seen.

Kemp is an improvement to the big league team immediately.

Gordon solidifies a position of need and he is not far away from the big leagues.

Profar from the Rangers is a very exciting prospect, but he is a ways away, and if you are going to trade Greinke I think you should get something to help the team now.

I would probably rather see Gardner than Kemp, but I don't think the Yankees will do that deal. For some reason I really think the Dodgers will do that deal.

December 17, 2010 at 11:54 AM

Blogger Nathan said...

Wow, Gardner over Kemp? 27-yr-old CF with .275 career TAvg and limited pedigree, over 26-yr-old CF with .286 TAvg and long considered a breakout candidate? I'd take Kemp. But maybe there's something to Gardner that I'm missing. For one thing, he probably does face tougher pitching in the AL East.

December 17, 2010 at 12:17 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Nathan-

You are not necessarily wrong. Either Gardner or Kemp would be a major improvement to the outfield.

I don't like the strikeouts with Kemp, and I think Gardner has more upside. No real numbers to back me up, just a hunch.

Both are very good defensively and that is sorely needed at every position. Maybe Gardner is a little better defensively, but again no numbers to back me up.

December 17, 2010 at 3:57 PM

Blogger Unknown said...

I just cant see how anyone could say that Gardener has more upside then Kemp.

If the Royals got Kemp & Gordon, where would they play? Gordon is not predicted to stay at short but rather head to CF. Of course Kemp could move to a corner but then some of his value would be lost.

But again, there is no way Gardener is a better option than Matt Kemp.

December 18, 2010 at 3:45 AM

Blogger lbp2 said...

Rany,

I hope you have your Greinke to Milwaukee post in the works.

Lebron Greinke, Betancourt, and $2M to MIL for Alcides Escobar, Lorenzo Cain, Jake Odorizzi, and Jeremy Jeffress. If you have not yet begun, commence writing.

December 19, 2010 at 6:09 AM

Blogger twm said...

Rany, I hope you have all day available to write 40,000 words on the Greinke trade.

December 19, 2010 at 8:40 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

They just traded away enough money to pay Crawford's salary.

December 19, 2010 at 8:46 AM

Blogger Michael said...

I absolutely LOVE the trade myself. Yes, we lose the Baseball Jonah, but we also shed ourselves of Yuni, and got a SS that can at least play defense, and a centerfielder with speed and defensive ability as well. Plus two pitching prospects, one that is pretty damn good too! He's a ways away from the majors, though. Pretty nice haul, I'd say!

December 19, 2010 at 9:51 AM

Blogger Vill Robinson said...

Be careful what you wish for, or you will surely get it in he form of Alcides Escobar and Lorenzo Cain...

December 19, 2010 at 9:51 AM

Blogger George said...

I hear that Jeffres is no longer a part of the deal. I realize he has drug issues and projects more as a reliever, but the guy can touch 100mph on the gun. Honestly, I'm a little underwhelmed by the deal. Escobar might be great defensively, but he can't hit a lick. Lorenzo Cain is similar in that he only has speed. We got Odorizzi who projects as a stud arm, but he's years away. Seems like we could have gotten more. I would have much preferred Drabek/Snider for instance. I hear we were asking the Nats for Storen, Zimmerman and Espinosa which would have been unreal. I don't know. Please correct me if I'm wrong, just seems like we could have gotten more...

December 19, 2010 at 9:57 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

If this trade goes through then I am done. I have been a fan for 35 years. I remember as a boy watching them all those years against the Yankees and then finally make it to the series against the Phils. I have participated in the Royals fantasy camp where I got to hang out with Willie Wilson. I attended a charity event where I got to play catch and hang out with George Brett. I fly to KC to see games and travel around the NE to games when they are in town. (I live in PA) I don't care that Greinke wanted out. I am tired of the perpetual jettisoning of talent for "prospects". I am just flat out tired. Sorry for the negative post all. Rany... I love reading your work. Cheers.

December 19, 2010 at 10:43 AM

Blogger Nathan said...

Much depends on whether you believe in the Alcides Escobar with a career .633 OPS or the Alcides Escobar who was a blue chip prospect two 635 PA ago.

December 19, 2010 at 11:02 AM

Blogger twm said...

Well, my concerns about Cassel were unfounded. Looks like a needed win is on the way in St Louis.

December 19, 2010 at 2:55 PM

Blogger Michael said...

Nathan, you are correct, a lot depends on Escobar. Is he the guy that Baseball America ranked as Milwaukee's top prospect before last season? Or is he the guy that hit .235 last year? I'm betting on the former, or at least somewhere in between. He has the tools and skills to hit much better than he showed last year, in my opinion.

What I like best is that we upgraded defensively at 2 positions. Both Cain and Escobar are difference makers in this area. We have been a laughingstock defensively for years, so I'm glad we're finally trying to address that area.

December 19, 2010 at 4:24 PM

Blogger George said...

Michael, hate to say it, but was this deal 'really' about defense? The Phils/Rangers/Yanks all got into a huge bidding war for Cliff Lee who is 6-7 years older and about $10M more expensive per season. Greinke is JUST now entering his prime. You can't tell me we couldn't have gotten more. I find it interesting that Greinke 'asks' to be traded and then suddenly is. Sure, Escobar is a nice talent, but really? This is all we got? How are we so sure we didn't get the next Angel Berroa or Neifi Perez? I just wish we could have gotten more. No pun intended.

Go Chiefs.

December 19, 2010 at 4:49 PM

Blogger Michael said...

We did have more, from the Nationals, until Greinke blocked it. Can't blame Moore for that. Both of those players (Escobar and Cain) are projected to improve offensively (both are only 24). Cain already was pretty good offensively last season, hitting .306/.348/.415. That, plus his stellar defense in center, and he's a pretty damn good player. He's not blue chip, but still a solid piece of the puzzle.

The Royals had many things working against them when trying to deal Greinke. First, was his public announcements that he wanted to be traded. That takes away leverage. He also could block trades to 15 teams, like he did with the Nationals (who were offering Drew Storen, Jordan Zimmerman, and Danny Espinosa).

So yes, we could have gotten more, if Greinke had played along with us. But he didn't (which was his prerogative), and that left us with this.

And like I've said, I like this deal a lot. Especially if Odorizzi and/or Jeffres are as good as advertised.

December 19, 2010 at 5:22 PM

Blogger Charles Winters said...

Had to think for a bit on this trade...

Concerned that Escobar might never hit major league pitching. But that's the risk you take sometimes. Do I wish we had got more? YES. The major weakness here is that Escobar and Cain could be just barely above replacement level. Do I think that? NO. I think Cain probably maps out to about 4WAR in a few years (a better fielding DeJesus at best) and Escobar about 2.5-3 WAR (not much with the bat but a great glove and excellent speed).

The two pitchers are what swing this deal; if they get good we are going to do really well in this deal.

December 20, 2010 at 7:49 AM

Blogger Michael said...

I agree Charles. I heard Buster Olney on 810 this morning, and one scout told him Cain could be as good as Mike Cameron. Great fielder, lots of speed, and occasional pop. Oh, and lots of strikeouts. That's his big downside. But if he ends up anything like Cameron, I think we'll be ok!

December 20, 2010 at 9:16 AM

Blogger Charles Winters said...

The Cameron comparison was one I hadn't thought of. I think he might have less power than that, but maybe somewhat higher walk rates. I'd take that. He might also map to somewhat better defense... I'd definitely take that. ON the down side - all those strikeouts could drown his productivity.

December 20, 2010 at 2:57 PM

Blogger Nathan said...

Better defense than Cameron?

December 20, 2010 at 6:38 PM

Blogger Michael said...

That was my thought too Nathan. Cameron is quite possibly the best defensive centerfielder of his generation. He's at least in the discussion!

December 21, 2010 at 10:35 AM

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