Well, like you--I don't fit in with the exmormon group--too much anger there for me. And I don't blame God for things that men have done. Since leaving the Mormon Church, I've tried many churches; so far none of them seem right for me. I've been thinking that when all is said and done, what really counts is how we treat other people--which can be done in any setting, circumstance, or in any religion. I like the quote from Einstein; he was a brilliant man; and he was always searching to learn more.
I don't agree with you about your statement regarding atheists having a near hatred toward God (or, I'd include, gods). We atheists cannot hate something we don't believe in, for one thing. For another, Dawkins is a warm, caring human being, and I'm pretty sure he considers himself a secular humanist as well.
Sure, there are some wackos in the atheist community who hate and are filled with anger, but the vast majority of atheists I've encountered are also secular humanists and have come to atheism through investigation, careful consideration and much reasoning.
We do not hate Christians (or theists of any other flavor) either. We do disagree with their ideas, and we especially disagree with them trying to force their religion into schools and government, and atheists are becoming increasingly vocal about that resistance.
Lastly, I hate to break it to you, but you're already an atheist. You said yourself that you don't believe in God (I'm guessing you don't believe in any gods, not just the one, right?). An atheist, by definition of the word, is someone without a belief in gods. Nothing more, nothing less. Many of us, while embracing the atheist label, like to go further and let people know that we're secular humanists, or objectivists or whatever our positive worldviews are. Atheism just labels what we don't believe, and most of us prefer to live by what we do "believe" in.
Thanks for your comments Mathyoo. Welcome to my blog. From where did you stumble upon my blog?
I find Mr. Dawkins a warm, caring individual, as well as Mr. Shermer or Salman Rushdie. Hatred is such a strong word indeed, and so I should use it sparingly. Even I tried to reduce its impact by saying something like 'near' hatred.
That post was also quite a while ago. Surprising, since then, I've been finding myself siding more and more with Atheists. I've been looking at the OUT campaign, hearing Mr. Dawkins call to arms for atheism.
But I'd also have to disagree about the inability to hate something you don't believe in. I mean to say, I find that more and more, I don't believe there is a God, but I look at the way belief in God has closed my mind for so many years. I see so many years that I think I would dismiss so many wonderful ideas because they might be seen as a sin to God.
I refused to read some books, listen to some ideas, rejected some of my friends who weren't of the same faith, etc. The list goes on. And then I think of the incredible atrocities committed in the name of God. It angers me, and I do hate that the theist superstitions are so strong that they block reasonable thought.
I think you are right, I probably am an atheist, but I'm just not sure I want to be 'defined' by the term because of the historically strong negative connotations.
Your last sentence sums it up for me. While I may be an atheist by definition, I'd rather be defined more by my other more human qualities.
May 10, 2009 at 1:22 PM
What Am I Now?
So, after thinking about why I'm not a Mormon, I gotta think about what I am. What do I stand for now. Am I still socially responsible? Do I still love my family? Do I still love my wife? Am I still honest? Am I an ex-mormon, a baptist, atheist or a Jack-Mormon? Who am I?
Ex-Mormon?
At first I thought that I might me an ex-mormon. But this group of people, while it does accurately describe me, does not really fit me. As I read their blogs and writings, I find so much hate. I know that I'm not a hater. I love people. I cherish my relationships with all people, and enjoy tolerance with them as much as possible. I can understand their hate toward mormonism. I felt it too, because at first, you feel like, they lied to me! But now, I realize that very few Mormons knowingly lied to me. Therefore, I can't be an ex-mormon. I think ex-mormon is a synonym to anti-mormon. While I am not for Mormonism for myself, I am certainly not heavily against it. So scratch Ex-Mormon for what I am.
Atheist?
I don't think that I'm necessarily against God either. While I don't believe in God. I don't feel the need to deny others their belief in God. As I read works from leading Atheists such as Richard Dawkins and such, my thoughts and emotions don't harmonize with them. I can see the reasons for their near hatred toward God, religion and the tragedies that have occurred related to them, but I just don't share their utter hatred and intolerance. Scratch Atheism.
Jack Mormon? I can't say. I don't even know one of them. Maybe I'll end up being one of them...
Baptist? I think it would certainly be more fun to be a Baptist. they have really fun meetings, and sing up a storm. But the more that I think within my soul, the more I find that I don't believe God exists. Today, there is a letter up for auction written by Albert Einstein. In this letter, he states, "The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish." Reference here. I find that this line of thinking resonates with me and sounds correct. Scratch Baptist, or any theist...
Humanist? Nearly a year ago, or so, I heard an interview on NPR with perhaps, Kurt Vonnegut. I was searching for some existing idea to attach or relate to. It was during this interview that I became familiar with the term 'Secular Humanist'. I was searching for a reason to continue to act, think and do moral things. When I heard this term on the radio, I immediately looked it up when I arrived at the office. I read the Humanist Manifesto and I was impressed with the ideas presented there. They believe that the fact that humans are humans, and that we are all fellow humans is intrinsically enough reason to treat each other as decent human beings.
This I resonated with. This sounds right to me. I am a warm, caring human being. I care deeply for my dear wife, Colleen, my children and the people that I maintain as friends and family. I see no reason to stop feeling this way towards them, just because I don't feel strongly in believing the God story any longer. Score 1 point for Humanism.
"Humanism, a possible model for moral humans"
4 Comments -
Well, like you--I don't fit in with the exmormon group--too much anger there for me. And I don't blame God for things that men have done. Since leaving the Mormon Church, I've tried many churches; so far none of them seem right for me. I've been thinking that when all is said and done, what really counts is how we treat other people--which can be done in any setting, circumstance, or in any religion.
I like the quote from Einstein; he was a brilliant man; and he was always searching to learn more.
May 20, 2008 at 9:02 PM
Thanks for your comments!
May 21, 2008 at 9:18 AM
I don't agree with you about your statement regarding atheists having a near hatred toward God (or, I'd include, gods). We atheists cannot hate something we don't believe in, for one thing. For another, Dawkins is a warm, caring human being, and I'm pretty sure he considers himself a secular humanist as well.
Sure, there are some wackos in the atheist community who hate and are filled with anger, but the vast majority of atheists I've encountered are also secular humanists and have come to atheism through investigation, careful consideration and much reasoning.
We do not hate Christians (or theists of any other flavor) either. We do disagree with their ideas, and we especially disagree with them trying to force their religion into schools and government, and atheists are becoming increasingly vocal about that resistance.
Lastly, I hate to break it to you, but you're already an atheist. You said yourself that you don't believe in God (I'm guessing you don't believe in any gods, not just the one, right?). An atheist, by definition of the word, is someone without a belief in gods. Nothing more, nothing less. Many of us, while embracing the atheist label, like to go further and let people know that we're secular humanists, or objectivists or whatever our positive worldviews are. Atheism just labels what we don't believe, and most of us prefer to live by what we do "believe" in.
May 10, 2009 at 6:43 AM
Thanks for your comments Mathyoo. Welcome to my blog. From where did you stumble upon my blog?
I find Mr. Dawkins a warm, caring individual, as well as Mr. Shermer or Salman Rushdie. Hatred is such a strong word indeed, and so I should use it sparingly. Even I tried to reduce its impact by saying something like 'near' hatred.
That post was also quite a while ago. Surprising, since then, I've been finding myself siding more and more with Atheists. I've been looking at the OUT campaign, hearing Mr. Dawkins call to arms for atheism.
But I'd also have to disagree about the inability to hate something you don't believe in. I mean to say, I find that more and more, I don't believe there is a God, but I look at the way belief in God has closed my mind for so many years. I see so many years that I think I would dismiss so many wonderful ideas because they might be seen as a sin to God.
I refused to read some books, listen to some ideas, rejected some of my friends who weren't of the same faith, etc. The list goes on. And then I think of the incredible atrocities committed in the name of God. It angers me, and I do hate that the theist superstitions are so strong that they block reasonable thought.
I think you are right, I probably am an atheist, but I'm just not sure I want to be 'defined' by the term because of the historically strong negative connotations.
Your last sentence sums it up for me. While I may be an atheist by definition, I'd rather be defined more by my other more human qualities.
May 10, 2009 at 1:22 PM