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Blogger Swanditch said...

Worth noting in this connection is the fact that top Theravādins like Chah, Sumedho, Amaro and Buddhadasa all downplay or reject the Abhidamma in favor of experience and the cultivation of insight.

Friday, October 21, 2011

Blogger Jayarava said...

Hi Swanditch

Yes, that is interesting. Experience does seem to be the key.

Cheers
Jayarava

Friday, October 21, 2011

Anonymous Gambhiradaka said...

I think that the shift from intellectual pondering about ontology as the Abhidhamma does towards exploring experience mirrors the individuals shift from being caught up in mental constructions towards their own direct experience.

I think that having the courage to 'prune' the cannon is important. I always liked Hakuin's insistence that people 'clear away the vomit of previous teachers'!

Just because somebody has written a book (even if it was a long time ago) doesn't mean that they had the insight to know what they were on about or what was important in the field of practice.

Ironically modern 'scientific' investigation into mindfulness seem to be more interested in what is actually happening in peoples experience than abstract theorising, which is good as science can, wrongly, be seen the other way around; not connected to peoples lives.

Saturday, October 22, 2011

Blogger Jayarava said...

Hi Gambhiraḍāka

"clear away the vomit of previous teachers"

Love it. I'm tempted to having as a strapline: "Jayarava's Raves: clearing away the vomit of previous teachers!" :-)

Cheers
Jayarava

Saturday, October 22, 2011

Blogger Swanditch said...

Or the story cited by Benoit in his work The Supreme Doctrine (which is relevant to the present discussion):

“One remembers that Zen master who, seeing one of his pupils poring over a Sutra, said to him:

‘Do not let yourself be upset by the Sutra, upset the Sutra yourself instead.’

For only thus can there be established between the pupil and the Sutra a real understanding.”

Saturday, October 22, 2011

Blogger Dhivan Thomas Jones said...

Hi Jayarava, I think this Rave makes you a Sautrāntika! Great stuff, I'm all for this kind of pruning.

Monday, October 24, 2011

Blogger Jayarava said...

Hi Dhīvan

Had a quick look at the definition and I suppose I am a Sautrāntika in my attitude to the Abhidharma. Not sure about some of their other doctrines...

For others the word Sautrānatika is made up of three parts: sūtra + anta + ika. The addition of -ika causes the of sūtra to stretch out to sau, and the 'a' on the end of anta is dropped.

Someone who says that the sūtras are the end of the canonical works holds a view which is sūtrāntaka. That person is referred to as a sautrāntika. The terms madhyamaka and mādhyamika follow the same model - the former is the view, and the latter is the holder of the view.

Monday, October 24, 2011

Blogger Der Unbuddhist said...

Hallo Jayarava

Regarding what you say about "these days [in which] any kind of claim to spiritual attainment is seen with suspicion."

From my experience in tibetan buddhist sanghas there is great need to speak about "spiritual attainment". I think people should not fear to try to express their experiences.

The only important thing about such a process is, that the conversation must have a certain quality of being free of violence. In such a setting then there could be the search for fresh expressions of experience with the intention to break free from all those empty signifiers or to revive them with immanent meaning.

Perhaps that would also encourage people who are interested in meditation to look at it with a more relaxed and creative attitude.

Thanks for this post, Matthias

Tuesday, December 06, 2011

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