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Anonymous Oil Painting on Canvas said...

nice blog i like this very much thanks for sharing such a great art with us

Friday, February 17, 2012

Blogger Swanditch said...

The only thing you've ever written that has caused a violent reaction to me is that dissing of the Stone Roses. :D

Sunday, February 19, 2012

Blogger Jayarava said...

@Swanditch.... something to offend everyone. :-)

Actually I liked the Stone Roses. I just did not think they "changed Rock n Roll forever".

Sunday, February 19, 2012

Blogger Adam Cope said...

I have dim memories of Paglia's book which I read some fifteen years ago (?)... If I remember rightly, she not only opposed law/order vs. chaos/creativity (men vs women as well as repression vs. orgasm) but also perfection vs. completion. Completion in the Jungian sense of incorporating rather excluding repressed Shadow material & organic biological Id life-force (hence the need for a larger frame, so as to fit more into the picture) rather than Super Ego 'appolloian' perfection .i.e a top-down construct, which she typified in the Nefetiti bust, with its highly individualised & chiseled lines.

Doesn't Buddhism have quite a lot to say about dualism? Maybe what Paglia perceives as polarity are just points in cyclic arising & falling?

Re-psychology of creativity, I find Antony Storr's 'Dynamics of Creation' a better bet, though as an artist myself, I can honestly say that practice is better than theory. These kinds of books are handy to an art educator seeking to kindle the flame.

You've noted on several occasions that you wish to critique Romanticism. OK with that. Then you go on to compare the play of Appolloian vs Dionysian polarity in art to politics.

Personally, I would have thought that applying these observations to religion rather than politics would have been a more interesting next step. After all, art is closer to religion than politics. Just a suggestion, you understand. I understand that one's religious practice is private & individual.

Mind you, I did appreciate the observation on the defective & dangerous moral calibre of our political leaders. It is a shame that our other leaders such as bank CEOs & big corporate business leaders remain relatively faceless, when in fact they are the real frame around our decision makers. How many times have we heard politicians (Obama for instance) say they will do something, only to be forbidden to do so by the bankers & CEO's etc.

BTW apparently Robert Thurman now advocates theocracy even if the Dalai Lama is trying to separate out his role as state leader from his role as religious leader.

Monday, February 20, 2012

Blogger Jayarava said...

Hi Adam

I was just reflecting this morning that we're already trying to promote religion in a culture which has fallen out of love with religion and authority.

Even Buddhists are becoming anti-religion. As I have seen several times now, if I am perceived to be prescriptive in the area of religion I get arguments and conflict (which I find increasingly tiresome) and I get abuse (which I don't publish, but makes me quite depressed). I could not write about religion in a time which I perceive to be overly Dionysian without advocating an Apollonian swing. If I do it in the realm of politics people just shrug, if I say that everyone should examine their attitude to the precepts and get on with following them, then I just invite conflict from the irreligious who don't want anyone to interfere with their personal freedom. Perhaps because 5/6ths of my readers are Americans they miss my emphasis.

The Buddhism that interests me has a mixed message on dualism. For example it says that atthi/n'atthi (exists/doesn't-exist) do not apply to loka (experience). But it also accepts dualisms such as kāyasika/cetasika (bodily/mental) dukkha. Dualism is not always a bad thing. And let us not forget that every afterlife theory necessarily is dualistic. A strict non-dualist policy precludes the possibility of an afterlife of any kind.

I'm also an artist and musician and have my own ideas on, and experience of creativity. I think FZ was spot on however in his observation about the frame.

I don't advocate theocracy. I certainly would not want the Dalai Lama as my leader as I disagree with him on matters of both politics and religion! Power corrupts. Not only does power corrupt, but saṃsāra is endless. There is no way to mend saṃsāra, and saṃsāra cannot be dealt with on its own level. The only way to deal with saṃsāra is to get out of it. Saṃsāra is not something one can legislate for, nor will resorting to hedonism solve the problem.

However I think everyone could benefit from Buddhist practices.

Monday, February 20, 2012

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I would just like to add two things. Firstly, Jayarava, the Dionysian and Apollonian both have postive and negative aspects and I think in your post you praise the Apollonian too much and condemn the Dionysian too much. For one thing I think that the Apollonian is definitely responsible for the way in which we try to control and dominate nature today which is easily visible from the way we treat animals in battery cages etc. We have lost a reverence of the natural that comes with the Dionysian and begun to think ourselves superior to nature.

My second point is that don't forget that Gautama Buddha could very easily fit into your description of the Dionysian. He self-abdicated from his position in society as prince and society which made him, to go and find enlightenment and this was primarily for himself. The Buddha also places great emphasis on individuality because he encourages us not to believe things or adopt things that we have not fully considered ourselves. He's quite Romantic, in this sense.

That's all!

Thursday, March 08, 2012

Blogger Jayarava said...

@Anonymous

My bias was because of a perceived imbalance. Perhaps you should read my essay again to see how I set out the case. You don't seem to address any of the points I made.

Gautama, if you read my earlier blogs on him, we almost certainly not a prince, and anyone who has read any Buddhism at all knows that the Buddha did not set out to find enlightenment for himself - that is a gross distortion of the Buddhist tradition. Even if we take the later legend of his princely status at face value, Gautama was troubled because his young wife and son would die, that everyone he knew would die. He was not so concerned about his own death. And so once he is established he returns home, in this version of the story, and teaches his wife and son and they become liberated just as he is.

There is no doubt that the Buddha had an Apollonian and a Dionysian side. But it was not expressed in the way you suggest. His period of asceticism was one of extreme Apollonian attempts to control every aspect of his body functions - an attempt to impose his will over his flesh. It was not until h relaxed that he began to be free. And once free his Dionysian side began to find more expression - in a few elaborate miracles for example.

Your assertions about individuality are just completely wrong-headed. I just don't have time to take that view apart and show how wrong it is. But you usefully read the series of posts on the Kālāma Sutta, since your mistake ideas seem, as they so often do, from a misreading and misunderstanding of that over-rated text!

That is most certainly not all, but one could say that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing!

Friday, March 09, 2012

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jayarava

I am a little surprised at your invective response. Can you not accept that others have a different understanding of the Buddha from you? And that what I have learnt about him also differs from you? Then again I don't know why I am surprised, you are after all an "American Buddhist" and so you are inclined to be opinionated and defensive

Friday, March 16, 2012

Blogger Jayarava said...

Dear Anonymous,

No one who reads regularly is surprised that I'm opinionated and don't suffer foolishness easily. It's not a matter of accepting different views. It's a matter of clarity of thought and expression - always. Sometimes we're just wrong. I'm often wrong, and people like to point it out to me too.

When someone is asserting something really very dull or stupid I'm often at a loss to know how to respond positively. You stated things were plain wrong, but you did so as if it were some great revelation and not simply your opinion. I didn't want other people reading my blog to think that I endorsed that view, or that it would be a useful way to approach the Buddha. I'm spent a lot of time and effort criticising that kind of view as being unhelpful.

Hopefully you'll reassess your ideas. But even if you don't learn anything, people who read regularly (the one's who'll put up with me) will almost certainly learn something - the positive effect of polemic is almost always peripheral.

And how about a name to respond to? Research has shown that I'm less likely to respond negatively if you take the time to tell me your name, and perhaps even introduce yourself a little. Otherwise you're just another anonymous stranger making a random comment. And what do I care?

Anyway I got a laugh out of it all when you accused of being American. Not even close my anonymous, disgruntled expositor. Not even close. What is about America that people can't see beyond it? So if you're going to insult me, you'll want to do a bit more research ;-)

Jayarava

Friday, March 16, 2012

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