Comments on Really Bad Cleveland Accent: Downtown Observations

Good point, Guv (and you have an interesting blog ...

2007-12-05T08:57:00.000-05:00

Good point, Guv (and you have an interesting blog that I'd never come across, by the way). I think the most progressive thing the city ever did, which set the tone for many other such decisions later, was tear up the highway hugging the river downtown and instead put in parks and walking trails. It literally transformed the entire city. I didn't know he was a Republican, but then, in Oregon, Republicans wouldn't get away with being doctrinaire conservatives.

good discussion on transit issues here. in regard...

2007-12-05T07:38:00.000-05:00

good discussion on transit issues here. in regards to portland and oregon being progressive, it should be stated that it was republican governor tom mccall who initiated many of oregon's 'progressive' policies in the mid 60's including the country's first bottle bill, as well as policies to keep waterfront land in the public realm and plan for land use on a statewide basis. today, mccall is memorialized in a waterfront park along the wilamette.

No, I understand. As for growth boundaries, that's...

2007-12-03T15:28:00.000-05:00

No, I understand. As for growth boundaries, that's really more a function of state government than anything. Oregon took the lead among the states, because they're just more progressive than most, but also because Portland and other coastal areas (Portland's actually a little inland, along a river) felt under siege by thousands of Los Angelenos fleeing overcrowding there. Anyway, the Oregon legislature is about two centuries ahead of the Ohio legislature on these kinds of issues, and I wouldn't expect them to catch up any time soon.

I wasn't really comparing TriMet vs. RTA as a whol...

2007-12-03T15:24:00.000-05:00

I wasn't really comparing TriMet vs. RTA as a whole, just their relative ugliness - based on Mr. Beckley's comment about the unattractiveness of overhead wires. And also probably because I've been reading Tim Gunn's style guide all afternoon. ;)

Wouldn't it be nice though if, amid all this talk of regionalism, *we* would institute some stricter growth boundaries?

Yes, Portland is maybe the best example to be foun...

2007-12-03T14:23:00.000-05:00

Yes, Portland is maybe the best example to be found anywhere of a great use of municipal light rail. But their uncommon density, brought about by the most aggressive use of urban growth boundaries in America, makes it more amenable to rail than most places, and thus not really a useful comparison for Cleveland.

Very interesting. Thanks for that link, Christine,...

2007-12-03T10:43:00.000-05:00

Very interesting. Thanks for that link, Christine, because I had no idea Charlotte was doing that. It helps, of course, that half of Ohio (and a few other midwestern states) seems to be moving to North Carolina these days. Plus, Charlotte is the new banking capital of the world, with the recently merged Bank of America being HQed there. So that economy is really humming, and they can thus afford their share. Sadly, most cities and regions can't.

Well, hopefully success stories like Charlotte's b...

2007-12-03T10:40:00.000-05:00

Well, hopefully success stories like Charlotte's brand-new light rail system will reverse that trend....

Oh, also, I think people have a dislike of buses b...

2007-12-03T10:34:00.001-05:00

Oh, also, I think people have a dislike of buses because "poor people ride them." In New York, there's a tiered hierarchy to who takes what kind of public transit: the richest people take cabs or have private cars, then there's the subway, then there's the bus.

Portland's TriMet trains have overhead wires, but they are pretty darn good-looking, I think....

Sorry, my error: that should have read "50% fundin...

2007-12-03T10:34:00.000-05:00

Sorry, my error: that should have read "50% funding from the feds."

The unfortunate reality, Christine, is that the fe...

2007-12-03T10:33:00.000-05:00

The unfortunate reality, Christine, is that the federal government has all but choked off further development of light rail around the country, even where it's really needed in higher-density cities than Cleveland. They've done this obliquely, by deciding that the federal contribution to these projects will be just 20%, while highway projects get 50% funding from the states. That generally means the former are dead on arrival, before they ever get off the drawing boards.

Hmm... I do like buses, actually. Van Aken and Sha...

2007-12-03T10:29:00.000-05:00

Hmm... I do like buses, actually. Van Aken and Shaker Blvd. are aesthetically pleasing with the rapid running down the median - what I don't like about the Red Line is that it's all hidden - you can't see it. Instituting a new, highly visible light rail line would (for me at least) be a sign that the city is serious about public transit -it's more permanent than just a bus lane, which could just be converted into a regular traffic lane. It also seems like light rail is one step closer to heavy passenger rail, although I have no proof of that, really.

I really miss the subway.

Another thought: in your original post, you expres...

2007-12-03T09:22:00.000-05:00

Another thought: in your original post, you expressed a preference for electric streetcars (on rails) over the buses that are actually going to be used on the Euclid Corridor. This is a very common preference, but what do you think it's based on?

For older people, I think a lot of it is nostalgia pure and simple, but I don't think that's true for people (like me) who never saw the streetcars in the first place. Ah, but you've spent time living near the Shaker Rapid perhaps? I forget about that. We didn't have anything like that when I grew up in the Washington DC area.

I personally think that city buses (not long distance buses, particularly) always seem ungainly and....slow. Underpowered and overwhelmed. I don't know if streetcars would seem different or not. These seem like purely aesthetic issues though, not a very rational basis on which to pick a transportation technology, but I do wonder how much of the dislike of buses (and I think it's very common, as I said above) are purely aesthetic issues like this.

Streetcars would be less smelly, maybe less noisy; those are real quality of life issues.

I do wonder if people remember all the overhead wires when they think wistful thoughts about streetcars. More aesthetics.

-john

"So ugly it's beautiful." A resonant phrase that m...

2007-12-01T13:39:00.000-05:00

"So ugly it's beautiful." A resonant phrase that many would argue applies to Cleveland itself. And you probably would have found more panhandlers later at night, though of course the downtown alliance's ad campaign has no doubt forced some homeless to seek other venues.

I doubt the city has ever demolished a downtown of...

2007-11-30T16:15:00.000-05:00

I doubt the city has ever demolished a downtown office building because it was empty. The property owners will do it if they think they can make more money from a parking lot than from a bulding.

-johnj (your neighbor, Christine -- I use a pseudo to blog)

A preview of the video can be found here:http://ww...

2007-11-30T15:56:00.000-05:00

A preview of the video can be found here:

http://www.makingsenseofplacefilms.com

Did you ever see the "Making Sense of Place" speci...

2007-11-30T14:03:00.000-05:00

Did you ever see the "Making Sense of Place" special regarding Cleveland on PBS? It came on last night at 9:00 PM. It's a very good special where Clevelanders discuss urban sprawl, Crocker Park, the decline of manufaturing, and even all the downtown parking lots. I understand it was cheaper to level historical buildings and make them parking lots than to leave them standing and empty because they were not helping the city earn property taxes. You should definitely check it out if you haven't already.

As for me, I live in Westlake but I love downtown, especially in the summer. Summer events like the Gravity Games and Ingenuity really helped me to appreciate the city. However, my concerns for my kids' education and crime in the city keep me in the burbs. At least for now.

Christine omg I almost choked on my lunch at the B...

2007-11-30T13:06:00.000-05:00

Christine omg I almost choked on my lunch at the Blvd of Death thingy lol. I'm hoping it's not quite that problematic on Euclid! I too wish there were trolley's but c'est la vie. The streetscaping sounds like it's going to be done well, time will tell.

I'm in love with the new wing of the Library; not so fond of any of the CSU bldgs, and lament the fact that we don't have a lot of Art Deco Architecture downtown...

Still thinking about the Blvd of Death...make a great name for a new band.